Spotted Dandy on Ebay

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Dandy for sale on ebay - its like mine and mine's great!

hannah3dog wrote:[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Dandy for sale on ebay - its like mine and mine's great!

Glad your happy with yours. Did you see Mikes comment on the for sale section? [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Is yours just the 4 as is or do you have an awning? How did you end up buying it or how did it fall into your possession?

The 4 in the picture doesn't have the flaps on the batwings to press stud the wings on. Unless there is something unsead or seen £350 does look a bit rich for a starting price?

The one on ebay is nothing to do with me - I just saw it and knew that people want them!

hannah3dog wrote:The one on ebay is nothing to do with me - I just saw it and knew that people want them!

Never thought that. It's just that you said it was like yours. Unless I've missed something we don't know what you have yet beyond an older 4 and it having pre auto reverse brakes.

If my reply read like I was snapping I apologise. This is not the sort of forum where anyone who has been on for a longer time snipes at new people. We only want to play nicely. Nosey but nice. (I like that last turn of phrase will I have to pay royalties to the estate of the late Frank Muir? Anyone of a certain age who liked cream cakes please feel free to explain)

It was a straight up tell us about your Dandy question. You seem to think it's 60's. The rod brakes continued till well into the seventies. One way to age it a bit better is the shape of the awning, if you have one. Don't forget "We Love Photos"


P.S. Thanks for posting.

Tow Itch don't worry! I bought it last Summer a bit on impulse and probably paid too much at £550 but missed 2 before.I had a pal look it over before bidding. I think its a 4/5 without awning. The chassis, running gear (7" lockheed), tyres, floor etc are actually pretty good though it needs an angle welding on to hold the sides where they've been chewed by stones off the road. I've undersealed it with Hammerite underseal. The PVC, beds, cupboards etc are fine. I've actually got spare as new indispension units with Knott brakes if I need them (£50 off ebay). A Riviera Heater to fit (again £50 ebay) and a flavel vanessa cooker grill (£20ebay). Plastic Mudguards £12 ebay.I'm planning to fit a foot pump for water. Its all so simple its easy enough to repair if you're handy with DIY though a forklift will be a definite advantage with any chassis welding! I put it on axle stands to underseal! I like the orange colour as its cheerful when its dull outside unlike brown or green and don't really need an awning as its already a million times better than the 2 man tent we normally use. I do worry about condensation inside when cooking and can see the advantage of cooking in an awning. We tow it behind a basic petrol 1.1 Peugeot 106 and it hardly notices. I'll confess I will need a cover soon probably from Jersey. Having looked through the 2012 list I can't tell if I spent too much but I'm happy with it. I love the retro look. Its my very own moon lander! If you PM me I'll let you have a couple of photos

hannah3dog wrote:Tow Itch don't worry! I bought it last Summer a bit on impulse and probably paid too much at £550 but missed 2 before.I had a pal look it over before bidding. I think its a 4/5 without awning. The chassis, running gear (7" lockheed), tyres, floor etc are actually pretty good though it needs an angle welding on to hold the sides where they've been chewed by stones off the road. I've undersealed it with Hammerite underseal. The PVC, beds, cupboards etc are fine. I've actually got spare as new indispension units with Knott brakes if I need them (£50 off ebay). A Riviera Heater to fit (again £50 ebay) and a flavel vanessa cooker grill (£20ebay). Plastic Mudguards £12 ebay.I'm planning to fit a foot pump for water. Its all so simple its easy enough to repair if you're handy with DIY though a forklift will be a definite advantage with any chassis welding! I put it on axle stands to underseal! I like the orange colour as its cheerful when its dull outside unlike brown or green and don't really need an awning as its already a million times better than the 2 man tent we normally use. I do worry about condensation inside when cooking and can see the advantage of cooking in an awning. We tow it behind a basic petrol 1.1 Peugeot 106 and it hardly notices. I'll confess I will need a cover soon probably from Jersey. Having looked through the 2012 list I can't tell if I spent too much but I'm happy with it. I love the retro look. Its my very own moon lander! If you PM me I'll let you have a couple of photos

If you intend to keep it and use it then you haven't paid too much,every trip away eats into its initial cost and makes it more of a bargain

We've also got an orange Dandy, it needs a little tlc that the weathers so far prevented. I bought it for my dad but it looks like he won't be using it when he's finished playing so we have two Dandy's again It'll be good to see how you go along with your orange Dandy, we could use some inspiration to get going with ours

hannah3dog wrote:Tow Itch don't worry! I bought it last Summer a bit on impulse and probably paid too much at £550 but missed 2 before.I had a pal look it over before bidding. I think its a 4/5 without awning. The chassis, running gear (7" lockheed), tyres, floor etc are actually pretty good though it needs an angle welding on to hold the sides where they've been chewed by stones off the road. I've undersealed it with Hammerite underseal. The PVC, beds, cupboards etc are fine. I've actually got spare as new indispension units with Knott brakes if I need them (£50 off ebay). A Riviera Heater to fit (again £50 ebay) and a flavel vanessa cooker grill (£20ebay). Plastic Mudguards £12 ebay.I'm planning to fit a foot pump for water. Its all so simple its easy enough to repair if you're handy with DIY though a forklift will be a definite advantage with any chassis welding! I put it on axle stands to underseal! I like the orange colour as its cheerful when its dull outside unlike brown or green and don't really need an awning as its already a million times better than the 2 man tent we normally use. I do worry about condensation inside when cooking and can see the advantage of cooking in an awning. We tow it behind a basic petrol 1.1 Peugeot 106 and it hardly notices. I'll confess I will need a cover soon probably from Jersey. Having looked through the 2012 list I can't tell if I spent too much but I'm happy with it. I love the retro look. Its my very own moon lander! If you PM me I'll let you have a couple of photos

As long as things are OK
I tried to use a tech media forum once where people snipped. Couldn't tell if they were condescending or patronising. Only visited about 6 times places like that are dreadful. We don't do that here.
Very much with Mike on the pricing issue. Could do the maths of if someone pays half what you did but uses it half as often and keeps it for half as long. Shove it the big thing is your happy with it.
£50 for a Riviera heater you did well there some daft prices over last few months.
Condensation while cooking? You have some rare model without an opening window?
Not noticing the Dandy when towing. I wonder if anyone who has towed a large trailer tent can understand how stable small Dandys are. Possibly looking at a dash with the Designer through France this year where the maximum tow speed is 81mph. Only slightly slower than I have towed The Green Un.
Brakes Suspension etc I have a Bradley type Hitch on The Green Un. Phoenix has a differing type. We didn't know what make it was I spent hours hanging round a display at Goodwood revival to find out that the hitch is a B & B type. If you have not worked it out already I'm that sad.
Bradley [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] B & B [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

4/5 The extra space over a 4 is useful though you will still be boiling with the Riviera. I'm cold blooded and had to turn off a heater the November before last. Just used a Tilley lamp to keep the chill off.
Again great deal on the suspension. Though you will end up swapping the back plates or needing a new coupling if the suspension swap time ever comes. The Green Un's suspension hasn't sagged but it does bounce around a bit apparently the other thing that happens over time is the units can firm up.

though it needs an angle welding on to hold the sides where they've been chewed by stones off the road.

What are your sides made of phenolic ply or plastic?

If you PM me I'll let you have a couple of photos

I will happily PM you with my email address for you to forward photos to me but now you have been here more than a week you can post photos direct. Are you not proud enough of your Dandy? They have feelings and you will hurt your Dandy if you don't post.

Adding Pictures How To [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] If your images are elsewhere on the web it's easier still. Right click on the image and select "Copy image URL" then just click on the image icon a box opens up right click and "Paste" into that.


Now the important bit if someone could just cross reference the "Nosey but Nice" comment and Frank Muir it might suggest senility has not yet set in.

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I found loading photo a bit tricky! The sides are phenolic. I'm planning to get a piece of steel angle welded on (cutaway along the bottom so its not a water trap) The bit between the side angle and side will be clamped and filled with sikaflex - brilliant adhesive/sealant to repair the phenolic sides. Supports for the new mudguards will be welded on the angle. The coupling is a Bradley (like your red one).I didn't realise I needed a replacement with new indespension - could you possibly explain why? The current units still bounce as they should and I'm hoping will be ok. It tows fine and the height is correct. Re the heater I had a VW camper with heater and that heated up too much really quickly. We use a gaz light that throws quite a bit of heat out and has the comforting roar. Yes the window opens. I'm still not sure how to set up the brakes but I'm sure I'll manage. They are in such good nick (all greased up and moving) I should have left them on. The previous owner obviously had it serviced regularly. Phoenix looked like a good project - If I had the space and a workshop I'd do the same! I'm in a damp garage with no electricity! Did I mention the tendency to rain in the Lake District

Looks great and the dog seems to be having a lovely time although I have to say you look a little pastey

Lovely pictures hannah3dog nice to see another like Phoenix.
We are a bit lost as to where you are planning to weld the angle on.
When we rebuilt Phoenix we were dodging the rain and thunder storms in the back garden. We put her under a gazebo tied down with wheels and concrete blocks, which helped a bit.

Snap!! brought mine last year for £240 and it's brill. This was the first trip last weekend and it was lovely and warm inside and -5 outside

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Dantro -your's looksgood - matching curtains too! when we first slept in ours we couldn't stop laughing it is so much better than a tent!
Phoenix the angle will go along the bottom lengthwise edge of the trailer just for the length between the mudguard brackets.
The vertical bit will be where the sikaflex goes to hold the side panels. The horizontal bit will be underneath the trailer welded to the box section but with bits cut out so that its not continuous (like square teeth).If it stops snowing I will try and post a photo when its done. It should also reinforce the box at its weakest point ie the axle. Hope that is slightly clearer than mud, I guess quite a few will suffer from the same problem unless mine is unusual. Anyway thats "The Plan"!
Helen Thats my partner face shaded not pasty!. Don't tell her we paid too much because she paid half! Tip (the dog) is only 3 but has hip displasia and had a new hip just after photo. He's just now allowed off lead.If you think Dandy was expensive £8,200 for new hip for rescue dog costing £80 (insurance Aviva have been brilliant - I'd only paid in for 12 months -

dantro's Dandy is 70's because of the sloped flaps for the awning. The first awnings had vertical sides a la Cazz's and Wayne's.
hanna's age Sorry hanna's Dandy's age? Could be 60's or 70's. The general ageing of Green (& Blue but not many) Orange/Yellow/Amber, (dependant on, light time in sun and week of production) Brown, Brown/White or Coffee, light Blue isn't quite true a few 60's are Orange and several Greens are 70's. The Green Un particularly so as it has plastic not aluminium corners.
With the older outward facing C section A frames I don't know if the serial numbers showing age are mythical. Just not known anyone who found the number.
Hanna if your having trouble with the sides (my sides are now going at the bottom) Phoenix and others have replaced with standard ply. This might only give 20 + plus years without periodic attention. If that seems slipshod the phenolic ply is available from a limited number of suppliers but is not cheap. Though if I remember correctly Phoenix paid a kings ransom to coat his ply.
Brakes & suspension. Last year someone wrote saying how they had bought just the stub axle 750Kg suspension from Indespension taken the backing plates off the brakes and up rated their suspension for sub £100. I think a similar action would be needed by yourself when the time comes. Rod operated Lockheed brakes on a manual reverse trailer would need more than new Knott brakes to auto reverse. A cheap ALKO coupling could be found from a scrapper but the old Lockheed backplates could just be transferred.
What braking problem do you have? The most common is a light skid or skip sound when one brake is coming on first.

Hi Tow Itch - I'm pretty sure the frames face outward like your photo of the coupling - I'll have to check. I haven't seen any sign of a number but its all been silver hammerited previously The sides I'm sure will patch up its only at their bottom edge that they need tidying

Thanks for your tip re suspension but I thought I could weld mounting plates on the chassis then bolt them on. Maybe move the mudguards to suit. I relalise I'd need to weld an anchor plate on for the Bowden cables but can't see why the existing rod and coupling (Bradley) can't stay (with a compensator plate to connect rod to Bowdens) Could you explain why this isn't a simple way? The Lockheed brakes and back plates aren't auto reverse which I may as well have if I fit new suspension so since I've got the whole lot I may as well fit it all? The Dandy only weighs 300Kg so 500Kg should be fine. I'm not planning on replacing the suspension and only got it as it was a bargain "just in case". But your input will be very welcome in case I decide to do it next year ie my partner gets fed up jumping out of the car to flip the brake stop every time we need to reverse!

Sorry Tow Itch - I should add I've got no problems (so far) with the braking - it works fine - I just took it apart to do preventative maintenance and was surprised what good fettle it all was! I'm just nervous because the rubbers must be ancient although they work fine

hannah3dog wrote:Hi Tow Itch - I'm pretty sure the frames face outward like your photo of the coupling - I'll have to check. I haven't seen any sign of a number but its all been silver hammerited previously The sides I'm sure will patch up its only at their bottom edge that they need tidying

Thanks for your tip re suspension but I thought I could weld mounting plates on the chassis then bolt them on. Maybe move the mudguards to suit. I relalise I'd need to weld an anchor plate on for the Bowden cables but can't see why the existing rod and coupling (Bradley) can't stay (with a compensator plate to connect rod to Bowdens) Could you explain why this isn't a simple way? The Lockheed brakes and back plates aren't auto reverse which I may as well have if I fit new suspension so since I've got the whole lot I may as well fit it all? The Dandy only weighs 300Kg so 500Kg should be fine. I'm not planning on replacing the suspension and only got it as it was a bargain "just in case". But your input will be very welcome in case I decide to do it next year ie my partner gets fed up jumping out of the car to flip the brake stop every time we need to reverse!

Hi Tow Itch - I'm pretty sure the frames face outward like your photo of the coupling - I'll have to check.

It will do.

Thanks for your tip re suspension but I thought I could weld mounting plates on the chassis then bolt them on. Maybe move the mudguards to suit.

I'd go with that part of the job.

I relalise I'd need to weld an anchor plate on for the Bowden cables but can't see why the existing rod and coupling (Bradley) can't stay (with a compensator plate to connect rod to Bowdens) Could you explain why this isn't a simple way?

Short question tortuous answer. I'm no guru with years of experience. A lot of my "knowledge is little more than years of messing around with bits and pieces and an ability to Google and cut and paste. Your idea about putting in a compensator plate to link up the bowden cables stumped me. I've never tried it to say it can't be done but if you look at the nature of the movements of the two mechanisms. The (Bradley) rod coupling has a sum total of movement of 1" or so certainly no more than 1¹/₂" the (ALKO) hydraulic coupling moves over a much greater distance. If you read the description of how the auto reverse system works it doesn't quite explain how this greater movement facilitates the drums dislocation when in reverse but without trying to mate up the systems I'm tempted to think there is a relationship. [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Trying to knock this out in a rush so I've not scoured Indespension's "Trailer Guide" to look for clarification. There is the statement of how the couplings are matched to brakes and that certainly is true the couplings come in differing weight (mass) allowances. Cheap reason why sticking with the Rod coupling would not be legal. Unbraked trailers have a chain or cable as a "Secondary coupling" As there is no legal requirement to retro fit, you are not legally required to fit a secondary coupling to your Dandy (but may do so). Hydraulically damped couplings don't have a secondary coupling they have a "Breakaway Cable" these cables are actuated as the trailer becomes uncoupled and the strain required to break the cable activates a .........? In most modern trailers the handbrake goes "Over centre" with the assist of a spring or gas strut. The ALKO couplings fitted to Dandys have a spring with a setting clearance. The exact function of these is not fully covered in any current explanation I've seen but I believe that they are an energy store. The handbrake is pulled on and ratchets to the poit where the cable breaks during this process the spring is tensioned. Upon the break of the cable the handbrake has been activated with the spring load engaged continuing to act upon the Bowden Cables to retard the trailer. This doesn't exactly explain the necessity of the spring. There is not a spring energy store in a normal handbrake yet I can see it's purpose in my minds eye (not a lot of use to you) it's something to do with a progressively increasing force on the cable (rather than a sudden jerk) taking the most force from the breakaway cable then having a constant force applied rather than a handbrake ratcheted to a point where slack then develops.
I have to do some brake maintenance soon on my Designer and will try to reference the spring function with either Ian (Riva) or Indespension. So the short answer is that even if the Bradley Knott combination worked to brake the trailer I doubt it would auto reverse and as there was no energy store in the system and it would not qualify as a modern braked system it would not be legal.

Related matters: The 8mm or so hole in the Bradley hitch will happily accept opening up to 11mm to allow the fitting of a padlock. that both helps prevent accidental unhitching (yes I know there is a catch on the mechanism) and is a security device. The security on mine not so much from the padlocks lock when most padlocks can be defeated with a hammer in seconds but in the tortuous sliding fit of the lock through the handle which needs some practice to remove.
If one has a system with a breakeaway cable a secondary coupling can also be fitted. e.g. travelling down the road and the hitch uncouples would you prefer the Dandy to come to a braked halt (Middle lane of M6) or stay attached to the vehicle. I consulted both the C&CC and the NTTA on this. The C&CC stated without reference that this can't be done (without reference to any law or guide) The NTTA stated it could be done and made suitable references. There are trailer weight limits if doing this but they are beyond that relivant to Dandys. I've covered this somewhere.

I may revisit this and add links later if somebody's is interested enough to read this and wants clarification.

Hi Tow Itch I'm abit baffled too but think you're correct that I will need new coupling though I haven't got my head round it yet!! The anchor/compensator plates are simple enough. The energy store I think holds the brakes on while its at rest to stop them auto reversing. (The damper prevents the brakes going on/off too quickly causing the trailer to jerk).So I think you can heave the hand brake on with non auto reverse but must have energy store for contolled pressure when applying hand brake for auto reverse brakes. I may have got it wrong - its very confusing! So I will have to keep eyes peeled for a new coupling but there must be loads around but I doubt they've got the same mounting bolts - I think I know where there is a scrapped Pennine. Good job you gave me your 10 pennyworth its certainly made me realise its not as simple as I thought and won't be bothering this year. Many Thanks (hope your typings quicker than mine!!!)

If all works there is no hurry.
As I said if the suspension fails then the other option is a transfer of backplates so you continue with the Lockheed brakes.

You seem to have a thing about the pain of jumping out to reverse. I tend to leave the brakes locked off if pottering about town then just throw the clip over when going onto faster roads. If being a pedant (which I'm known for) I don't think the brake being blanked off comes under the province of "If brakes are fitted they must function" as this was the manner in which these brakes were originally used.

Tow Itch wrote: If all works there is no hurry.
As I said if the suspension fails then the other option is a transfer of backplates so you continue with the Lockheed brakes.

You seem to have a thing about the pain of jumping out to reverse. I tend to leave the brakes locked off if pottering about town then just throw the clip over when going onto faster roads. If being a pedant (which I'm known for) I don't think the brake being blanked off comes under the province of "If brakes are fitted they must function" as this was the manner in which these brakes were originally used.

When you consider the weight of the smaller units they won't make no difference to an average car, mine are off all the time as they too have a habit of locking up when driving.

Tow Itch I tow wayfarer dinghy around + camping gear 300 kg I'm sure heavier than Dandy - guess what its got no brakes!

I can't remember where I read it but am sure I did ........ that if a unit has brakes they must be functioning.

I think it was something to do with police safety checks or insurance.

Oh I wish I could remember where I read this it's frustrating getting older

Probably on here somewhere - I've read it too [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Thinking about energy store I think by maintaining the same pressure it prevents depressing the drawbar actuating tube too far which would initiate auto reverse? Kept me awake last night wondering what it did!

Definitely if a trailer is fitted with brakes they have to be in a working condition.

If the reversing lever is on they are disabled or switched off and are prevented from working as intended whilst the vehicle is moving forwards, so would not be in a working condition. When reversing I often move forward a bit to line things up better and I certainly wouldn't expect to get out and flip the reversing lever off.

If lights are fitted to a vehicle they have to work under one law but they don't have to be switched on during daylight. The requirement to switch them on would be another law. Not sure if that could set a precendent.

You can legally tow an unbraked trailer up to 750kg as long as it is not more than 50% of the weight of the towing vehicle or exceeds the manufacturers' unbraked towing limit. But that says you can tow an unbraked trailer but doesn't say you can tow a braked trailer with the brakes disabled.

Even though it may sound a bit wooly (even ignoring the definition of weight), if there was an accident and the reversing lever was on disabling the brakes, it would surely be deemed to have contributed to the accident and the driver could be found to be negligent, driving without due care & attention or dangerous driving etc.

Thank you I knew I had read it somewhere